- The disturbing "Cult of Personality". The streets are littered with posters of Lebanese politicians, both dead and alive, in a variety of nauseating poses. Just like any other Arab country, I suppose. The most disturbing are of the dead ones. Moussa Al-Sadr disappeared in 1985 and Bashir Gemayel was assassinated in 1982. Move on already!!
- The cheap posters of President Lahoud, "photoshopped" onto Bashar Al-Assad, with the names of the ass-kissers who produced them printed below.
- Will someone explain to me how certain neighborhoods came to be named after the buildings and companies that dominate them? Sodeco, Gefinor and, for fuck's sake, Solidere?! Imagine if Salmiya was renamed URC or Al-Fanar or Sultan Centre!
- Kuwaiti drivers maybe homicidal maniacs, but we do stop at traffic lights. Eventually.
- The weather in February.
- The short ski season.
- The corrupt politicians.
- The fact that after 15 years of civil war, most people will tell you it was fought for nothing.
- Dunkin' Donuts in prime locations.
- Arabic with a French accent.
While I personally haven't experienced this, many Kuwaitis feel that Lebanese look down on them for whatever reason or stereotype. It may be true, but I also believe that stereotypes are unfair generalizations rooted in fact. One rotten experience results in a sweeping generalization, and that is unfortunate. But it also works the other way round: Many Lebanese feel inferior when they're here in Kuwait.
Why is that?
First and foremost... I am suprised by Patrick... he is a person who loves Kuwait and not too fond of Lebanon. Way to go Patrick!
ReplyDeleteNow it's my turn! I also will not "dissect" every tiny detail... but hey let me put it this way... you go to Lebanon for a couple of days and think you're some expert on the place?! lol (i am sure you were expecting this)
1. Cult Personality:
a) President Bashir Gemayel.
i) he was assassinated. His assassin who is known was never taken to court. He will not be forgotten by his family, or by others who loved him, until justice is made.
ii)President Bashir Gemayel was a man who had a cause. He died for this cause. He was the last good President of Lebanon. He will not be forgotten by anyone.
iii) Cheikh Bashir was a LF leader before he was President, he united, secured, and protect the Christians in Lebanon. As a Chrisitan myself I would never forget that.
iv) he is a role model to many and should be a role model to people such as the traitors and cowards who have the leadership now.
v) for more information about Bashir Gemayel, I posted an article about him just yesterday. http://rampurple.blogspot.com/2004/09/rest-in-peace.html
b) there is a whole list of people who were assassinated in Lebanon before the war, during the war, and after the war. Justice is still waiting to be served. Those people will never be forgotten no matter what religion, sect, or political party they were from.
c) General Aoun is exiled in France. Samir Geagea is in prison. Other people are having the time of their lives in Lebanon. Where is the justice in that. Either put all war criminals in jail, or free samir geagea.
d) As for President Lahoud's pictures, sometime earlier this week he requested his posters to be removed.
2) Naming places... you would never understand why. Gefinor was actually the only building standing in its area after the war... that is why people called it the Gefinor area... they got used to it. There was no freaking area there. The area isnt actually called gefinor, or solidere, or sodeco. Actually there is Sodeco square... which is an area between the sodeco complexes... so i dont see any harm there.
3) Traffic lights... that's why the cops in Kuwait are making so much money from the radars on traffic lights, and thats why you see major accidents at traffic lights.
4) February is actually one of my favorite months in Lebanon. Beautiful stuff for real!! Nice, cool, rainy weather.
5) 3 or 4 months is not so short.
6) Corrupt politicians... please! I cant believe YOU said that.
7) When people say it was fought for nothing, they mean that nothings improved, things went back. no one got what they wanted. people died for a lost cause.
8) I actually think its a good thing. Since it is cheap, the lower class people have a chance of enjoying these "prime situations" as well. I love dunkin donuts by the way. missssssssss it like hell.
9) Well, they're french educated. i knew a kuwaiti girl who spoke kuwaiti with a british accent. it depends on their education, and what they speak at home. to each his own.
10) Dont see why they should feel inferior. I am a proud Lebanese, and NEVER felt inferior in Kuwait. Its all got to do with a persons confidence dear.
Zaydoun you forget that in Kuwait we name our streets after builings: Canada Dry, Pepsi Cola, Sheraton Circle, Passport Circle etc.
ReplyDeleteDid any of you bother to scroll down and read the post I put up before about why I LOVE Lebanon? Or are you not used to reading positive things?! I will respond in no particular order to the points worth discussing (I won't argue about the weather, because I hate rain and that's that)
ReplyDeleteAgain.. if any of you had bothered to read my prior post - a friggin' love letter to Lebanon!! - you would've understood that I do NOT intend this to be a Kuwait vs. Lebanon discussion. I don't want to compare the two because it would be like comparing apples and oranges!
Bashir Gemayel: I knew you guys would take the bait and explain his legacy to me. RAM, I've seen your online shrine to him, so I knew what I was in for. But I have a question. Is/Was there ONE leader that ALL Lebanese can agree on? Would Lebanese Muslims or Druze feel the same towards Gemayel? I'm curious.
Many Lebanese feel they are mistreated by Kuwaitis here and that's what I meant. Care to elaborate on that?
And yeah, the corrupt politicians. I hate them everywhere and God knows I've railed against our own right here. Go through the archives if you can't remember. Doesn't prevent me from criticizing them in Lebanon.
The ski conditions in Faraya-Mzar are only ideal for a short period from mid-Jan to mid-Feb. That's how its been for the past 3 years. I went early last March and the snow was all slush.
I hate Starfucks, they're the McDonalds of coffee, but at least their branches look nice and low key. Dunkin' Donuts glaring fluorescent lights clash with their beautiful surroundings in Beirut. Downtown (that's "Solidere" to you) and at Oceana Beach Club are two examples. I wouldn't care if it was in Verdun or Zalqa or Burj Hamoud, or even Jounieh.
Nibaq, I totally missed that one. But Solidere is a new company and I refuse to name downtown Beirut after it, like it has no history or identity.
Finally, I did NOT base my judgements on a weekend's visit. I've been going for years (10 times in 2003 alone) since I was a kid before the war and I base my opinions on discussions with my Lebanese friends WHO LIVE THERE and my family's friends who are there too. That's the only remark that offended me, btw.
OT, Is the general attention span on the blog limited to one post per day? Please let me know so I don't get carried away with more than one post if nobody's going to read the other one(s).
Thanks Zaydoun for the post about Lebanon, I have a love affair with that country and have been visiting it as well since I was a kid before the war. Hey what don't we meet there once ? I like Downtown for its crowd of beautiful people but it does lack a soul don't you think so ?
ReplyDeleteErm Zaydoun... just because you posted a post that says I love Lebanon does not mean you are safe to then create a list of stuff to criticize lebanon in. As for Bashir Gemayel, if you did read my "shrine" you would have read that during his elections, only 2 druze members boycotted, and everyone else approved. The GREAT MAJORITY of Lebanon wanted him as a President which is why they were devesated when he was assassinated. My mom, who is Armenian, and is not at all fond of the LF or Kataeb party cried her eyes out for him with the rest of their neighbors. My Muslim and druze friends and family love bashir as well. If you also read the comment I have above...you should be able to realize that comment was more on justice and not on love... with bashir gemayel or others
ReplyDeleteAs for your other lousy comments..... you dont want dunkin in downtown coz it colors clashes?! man seriously stick to kuwait.
you know what... i dont know why i even bother.
oh by the way... how would you feel if somebody told YOU to get over the POWs?! Same concept really... justice waiting to be served. People awaiting their loved ones.
ReplyDeleteDO you know that there are Lebanese POWs as well in Isreal and in Syria?
adios
please dont talk about something you dont know anything about. kuwait has bigger issues which you should focus on first before you start running your mouth on Lebanon and issues you have the slightest idea on.
ReplyDeleteif you live in a glass house, dont start throwing rocks at your neighbours.
OK so I obviously struck a raw nerve with this post, enough for all of you to forget anything good I had to say about a country that I love dearly. I never claimed to be an expert on Lebanon, nor do I question your observations on Kuwait.
ReplyDeleteThere are a variety of opinions out there, and we're all entitled to form our own. Observations are only remarks that require further explanation from you, the readers. In my case, they are observations of a visitor to another country. It's very obvious that there are things I don't understand about Lebanon, and this is where you come in. To explain, not to attack. But to each his/her own style I suppose..
And you don't have to delete your comments if you think they're too harsh (I could do that for you, but I won't). I believe in free speech, but I don't believe in insulting people.
Patrick says "One more thing, there's no reason for you to try to be witty and try to indirectly insult us, the people who comment on your blog, I don't like it when a person implies I'm stupid or not intelligent, Dude, you knew this post would cause a problem, you should've written it differently, you're smart enough to realize that, a monkey would've known that."I'm neither being witty since I don't see anyone laughing, nor am I insulting anyone. But obviously the Gemayel subject hit a such raw nerve to the point where my silly comments on the other trivial subjects unleashed an unexpected fury from you all. I'm willing to bet that if I had left Gemayel out of the post, you would have yawned and moved on to the next blog on your list. Btw, the "bait" was the subject not the man himself
When I criticize things in Kuwait - as I do most of the time - all of you Lebanese bloggers join in with your own criticisms and that's fine with me. Never once did I tell you to stuff it because you don't know what you're talking about. And yet, when I posted a few observations about Lebanon, you all went ballistic!
Will someone please explain the extreme sensitivity? How is it that I wasn't even acknowledged for all the good heartfelt things that I had to say? Not one word of thanks, or even a little smiley! I'm not fishing for compliments or gratitude since you don't owe me anything, but you didn't bother to even agree or disagree with the good things I had to say.
40-tactical, perhaps you're new to the blog? If so, welcome aboard. Please take some time to go through the archives and you'll see that no target is safe here. Our glass house is already smashed!
And finally, Patrick.. this isn't a writing contest so I don't really care who's the better writer. If I honestly thought I was a good writer, I'd be working on a novel :-)
Lists are easier to read
ReplyDeleteWell that's the trouble with blogs. If I elaborate too much, I risk losing readers. And if I attempt to be concise I get hammered! ;-P
ReplyDeleteI just want to ask our Lebanese (brothers?) here to cool down a little, Zaydoun loves and cares about Lebanon and probably spent more money to improve your country's fucked up economy than all of you combined. he is not a Syrian or a member of Hezbollah so take note of that before you gather around him for a kil.
ReplyDeleteLebanon is A Shia land now anyways, and what Nasrallah and Berri say goes...and both have the full support of Arabs ..even the Wahabi Saudis for Gods sake! Not even Israel can change these facts, and your old fucked up leader Aoun who was supported by another Fucked up leader Saddam wont come on his tank to wipe out the non Christians and Syrians to make it all nice and tidy for you cowards to go back and be (Lebanese) again.
I'm against the Syrian occupation of Lebanon but after hearing you guys, one would think that Lebanon will turn into one big blood bath once the like of Aoun takes power. As Kuwaitis we know how it feels to be occupied and felt just as disgusted as you now, but don't turn into mad dogs and tear apart anyone who LOVES your country and no Arabs want the Syrians to leave your country more than Kuwaitis, and just take a look at our Local newspapers like Al-Seyasah daily , and Al-Qabas to see how strongly we feel against the Syrians and their puppet Lahoud.
If you felt cheated or back stabbed by some Arabs, don't think that all Arabs are the same, and like Zaydoun I have been connected to Lebanese people ( Christians and Muslim ) here and in Lebanon through family ties for decades. And I heard the same discussions here over and over again. Nothing new, just your utter ignorance about the true love and respect guys like Zaydoun have for your country.
Loooooooooooool!
ReplyDeleteZaydoun... this has nothing to do with Gemayel... jeez... no one is attacking you or anything... what we are trying to say is that you criticized the silliest things... like you have admitted... the stupidest things... like dunkin colors clashes with downtown... listen, i lived in lebanon for 6 years and I dont consider myself an expert at it... and you shouldnt either just coz u vacationed there a few times .... just think before you publish... people read your blog and will minterpret what you say... thats just it... as for us criticizing kuwait... i never get into ur discussions on kuwait... and even if i did, i was born and raised in kuwait... i lived in kuwait my entire life... so i would only talk about something i think i would know something about.
as for mad m... what???? what did all you say have anything to do with this entire discussion?
since you guys enjoy lists... here is my list of mad m's stupid sayings in his comment:
1- Zaydoun loves and cares about Lebanon and probably spent more money to improve your country's fucked up economy than all of you combined.(wtf?! you can wipe ur ass with ur money)
2- he is not a Syrian or a member of Hezbollah so take note of that before you gather around him for a kil. (this has nothing to do with political parties... dont make it that way)
3- Lebanon is A Shia land now anyways, and what Nasrallah and Berri say goes...and both have the full support of Arabs ..even the Wahabi Saudis for Gods sake! (this is nothing about religion either... and by the way... we want a country where muslims and christians can live together... we dont want to create another iran or saudia...also, research all u said)
4- Not even Israel can change these facts, and your old fucked up leader Aoun who was supported by another Fucked up leader Saddam wont come on his tank to wipe out the non Christians and Syrians to make it all nice and tidy for you cowards to go back and be (Lebanese) again. (cowards? lol u make me laugh... lets not open up wounds of the iraqi invasion, where the majority of kuwaits fled the country... u cant tell me, 12 million lebanese are cowards just cause they live abroad)
5- I'm against the Syrian occupation of Lebanon but after hearing you guys, one would think that Lebanon will turn into one big blood bath once the like of Aoun takes power (what does this all have to do with aoun????? shows you dont know anything!)
6- If you felt cheated or back stabbed by some Arabs, don't think that all Arabs are the same, and like Zaydoun I have been connected to Lebanese people ( Christians and Muslim ) here and in Lebanon through family ties for decades.(none of us have been back stabbed, or else we wouldnt be living in kuwait, and should i give u a standing ovation for loving lebanon, having lebanese friends, who it is so obvious you dont discuss lebanon with????)
Thank you!
All zaydoun cares about is trying to be popular. He speaks about something he has no clue about just to speak. Shoo zaydoun running out of things to post? need some tips? So what if areas are being called after companies that helped build them? In the states its common how come its not allowed in Lebanon? Imagine Salmiya was renamed Sultan Center? Where is the connection? Did Sultan center build Salmiya? Nothing even close in similarities. What are you on man??
ReplyDeleteSecondly you are talking about driving in Lebanon... come on where do you live? Only in the country with the highest car related deaths per capita in the world... and you are talking about driving in Lebanon??? pleeeaseee...
Lets not talk about the politicians in our country unless you want to talk about the politicians in Kuwait and who really controls them.
Man seriously get a life, or atleast some education before you come in here and start preeching.
I just have one question to the lebanese bitch/asshole who is born and raised in Kuwait...why the fuck are you here ?? if it wasnt for the (Cash and only Cash) you said that we Kuwaitis should wipe our asses with!?
ReplyDeleteIf there is another reason for you to be born and raised here or your daddy to pick Kuwait out of any other Arab, European , African or south american country other than to get our ass-wiped cash...then lets hear it...if there is none then shut the fuck up please and go back to your Zara duty
Patrick keep your semi-Lebanese ass out of this..I asked that girl a question and I'm waiting for an answer...and still waiting....and go ahead talk all you like about Kuwait...if you checked my blog or know anything about me..you will know that I exposed more bullshit about Kuwait and Kuwaitis than all of the online Kuwaiti papers you try to read - ...We DO talk our minds freely here and give our honest opinions without going berserk and feeling all offended just because someone who you see as - a buduin Arab - made an honest, intelligent, and a very accurate observations on your country or people...if I say for example that Bashir Al-Jmayyel posters look like Stalin's ..then its my opinion, it doesn't matter if you agree or not Same shit if I though that a Dunkin' Donuts joint in the age of Krispy Kreme is really tacky and shows bad taste..its how I see it and no motherfucker can tell me otherwise... and as a tourist or as an investor or a house owner there I have every right to talk about this or complain....I've done it in London and San Francisco why cant I do that while spending my weekends in Birut?!...I dont want a communist looking poster in front of my Birut appartment and Dunkin' Donuts is plain ugly .....if you are annoyed or disgusted by me saying this...tough luck buddy...try to live with it and expect more...much more...... I'm not going to open the rotten can of Lebanese politics, but I wont keep quite just because I have to show respect and endless admiration to my (12 million) Phoenician brothers and sisters. While they talk shit and try to bite the only Arab hand that is willing to shake theirs.
ReplyDeleteIf you are feeling bored there are few who can make your life a bit more fun on the net than little old me. Just don't let me start please...I promised myself not to ass-fuck other Arab or Semi-Arab nations , but my hand is getting really itchy and there are tons of material here.
And one more thing there is nothing wrong or disrespectful about working at Zara why did you feel offended all of the sudden?
My shoe size is 45 European btw
MadM that's cute.
ReplyDeleteI never told the Kuwaitis to wipe their asses with money... I told YOU to wipe your ass with your money.
Mad I dont have anything against kuwaitis or kuwait actually. i love it, and like i mentioned somewhere above, its my home. Actually i always thought ur blog was rather negative when it came towards kuwait... and i feel that u have influenced zaydoun as well. you see zaydouns blog has always been pleasant to read until he turned all negative a few months back... but hey i still read it, coz everyone has his opinion.
if its ur opinion that dunkin donuts is tacky or gemayel posters resemble stalin posters than ok, it is your opinion. BUT if you come and say move on... that's where i do step in... for the reasons why, u have to do back up to my first, second and 3rd comment when we were still on still discussing the same topic.
i have said all i can say about this topic but you know whats ironic, you stopped blogging because you realized the level of people discussing are low, or the discussions themself are low... well your last 2 comments (i wont even mention the others) showed what a lowlife you are calling names and stuff. reminds me of a jerry springer store. oh and patrick, mad is right, there absolutely is nothing wrong with working at zara... at least us non kuwaitis work and keep the economy in kuwait moving.
Very true we cant keep our economy running if we don't get help from the people of Lebanon - Which has THE best run economy in the history of man kind. How can we earn one fucking dinar if we don't have a daily plate of Tabooleh, have our hair stylized just right, and listen to that sexy French flavored accent? And how in hell are we going to live if no one at NBK would sneak a look at our accounts and drool like a retard?
ReplyDeleteThank you for keeping us and our economy running...we appreciate it and enjoy it very much...even though the "amazing Christian Hummus" you serve us seems little (madroob) compared to the non Christian kind ;)
Try again..this time with less garlic...more Tahene
My God!! What's the matter with you people?! I take a break for 2 nights and all hell breaks loose?!!
ReplyDeleteThis is not the level of discussion I envisioned on this blog. SHAME ON YOU!!!!
40-tactical, I welcomed you to this blog but I see my manners were wasted on you. You can hang around if you want since I can't kick you out, just know that your presence is annoying.
Mad M2000, I don't know what's come over you but this is the sort of thing you NEVER tolerated on your own blog. What gives?
Patrick, that was uncalled for and you know it!
ReplyDeleteRAM, you have every right to worship your dead leader. Just understand that it's perfectly acceptable for others to find it a little strange. I also have my reservations over your claim that all Lebanese from all sects and religions loved him just as much the small Phalange minority. But what do I know?
Anyway, this post has caused more harm than I ever imagined. Even my efforts to shame you went unnoticed.
By the way, before we put this discussion to rest and move on to something else.. I would just like to tell all the Lebanese guests on my blog that I have been making the same observations that you found so offensive, to my Lebanese friends in Beirut (Christian & Muslim) for years.
ReplyDeleteTheir reaction? They're just flattered that I actually give a shit!
You guys just don't get it, do you? We never claimed to be perfect, and if you've been regulars on this blog you know very well that I've been criticizing a lot of things about this country. So when I point out similar things elsewhere that are not much better, I don't see why you should all get a bug up your ass!
ReplyDeleteWhat I find truly disturbing, and something I hope is only limited to a few people here on the blog, is this sense that as a Kuwaiti I have absolutely NO RIGHT to say ANYTHING about Lebanon or any other country because in your eyes we're a bunch of "ignorant bedouins"!!??!!
Is that true or am I mistaken?
Meanwhile, over on MadM2000's blog....
WoW, a classic case of Arab intolerance. I don't think we (arabs) accept any cristism, and its obvious that there is extreme sensitivity of Kuwaities blogging on Lebanon. I have a feeling there would be this sensitivity of any critism that a renouned Kuwaiti blogger will post on any other country than his own. I also see a heavy case of lack of maturity when ppl use words like 'monkey' and when they put up shrines for dead people, prophets or political leaders. Emotional Emotional Emotional Arabs, just move on. Let the courts do their job & move on!
ReplyDeleteImagine if we have posters of Abdulla Al-Salem (founder of new Kuwait) all over Kuwait. I tell you, as an outsider any posters of political figures in a beautiful country like Lebanon is very stifling and has a communist/baathist feel to it. I hate all the posters up in Lebanon, from the guys in turbans to 7afez al-Asaad, to all the Lebanese presidential alumni (dead or alive). I guess we expect more of the country which educated many many arabs.
Yes, i suspect some of you are getting pissed off because i am calling you Arabs. But dont worry, we all know that Lebanese are mainly arab musta3reba i.e. arabs by association and by birth and tongue rather than by ethnicity.
Zaydoun, your post was very subjective, but its obvious that anything but a love poem is not welcom, you have to remember that not all Arabs have had the liberty of saying what they want when they want and get away with it with out a good beating.
I cannot imagine such a response from the French if Zaydoun had written about Paris, can you?
I am speechless, you guys made a big deal out of nothing. Zaydoun my advice to you:-
ReplyDeletefrom now on stick to subjects about sex.
Anyway, well done 100%..
they can dish it but they cant take it
zaydoun... i posted something on the matter on my blog... i hope things become clearer.
ReplyDeletethings just got too ugly and nasty here.
i know u didnt intend for it but i also didnt intend to read some of the comments posted by others.
Sheba, the French have enough pride not to care what anyone says about them.
ReplyDeleteBtw, in spite of their efforts to project a Western sensibility, the Lebanese have done more to enrich and preserve Arabic culture than any of us (or them) realize. That was supposed to be part of my "love letter" post, but my PC kept crashing and when I finally wrote it I forgot it. Which is just as well, since it would've gone unnoticed like the other nice things I said.
zaydoun... none of the nice things you said about lebanon have gone unnoticed ... trust me.
ReplyDeletei know lebanon has good and bad things...neither me or patrick were attacking you on your opinions. patrick said what u said may be correct but you simply said them in the wrong manner. when i commented i was simply trying to make things clearer for you. after i commented all you focused on was my love for bashir gemayel, you forgot the other things i was listing and trying to make sense of... and madm turned into a ... i dont know what to call it... he misunderstood everything... this is why i posted on it on my blog...
all of the good things i said in my previous comments went unnoticed as well...
as for... i cant remember who it was,sheba or mosan, this has nothing to do with our identities. none of us mentioned anything about being arabs or not. stop bringing things into the discussion that has no relevance. when zaydoun posted this post, he did not mention religion, sects, parties or any of the sort, neither did we, i dont know why the rest of you are.